788 . - David Owen

All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Stateside with Kai and Carter, a new podcast from The Guardian. And they are using this podcast to slow down the news and wrestle with the questions that we all have about what's happening in the world. And they do it three times a week, Jason. Does that sound familiar to you? We don't really talk about, you know, a lot of international global news items and climates and cultures and sports and things like that. We do talk about fashion and wellness, but for everything else, Kai and Carter are a great place. All right, so who couldn't use more news? Listen wherever you get your podcast. or watch on YouTube. It's Chris. It's How Long Gone. It's Jason. It's How Long Gone. What's good? You know, early morning, early morning. I can't wait to ask our guest why he had to move it up an hour early last minute. Oh, no, that was me. That was me. That wasn't him. Okay. Yeah, I'll take the L on that. So I guess you phrased it in a way of, like, instead of saying, like, can you record it this time instead of this time, you said we got to move it an hour early. I did word it that way. You're right. And I apologize. Which seems like a manipulative move. Could you say more about that? Yeah, you know me. I'm so manipulative. You are. Well, I wanted to know what the emergency was. Oh, it's not an emergency. You at least owe me what the emergency was. It's not an emergency at all. I just fucked up the timing because of the time change. What do they call it here? Well, no, I'm trying to think of what it's called. We call it daylight savings time, but they don't call it that. in europe they call it something else or they don't i can't remember they call it something else i think they can maybe just call it summertime but two words not one okay so we had to move it up an hour early because it's summer no because i had something to do that i thought i was in the clear on and then i was i just want i mean i'm i'm only giving you a hard time i'm just i just want you to tell me the thing that you did instead of

of doing oh no no no it's no no it's just dinner that was planned for me i knew i was what is it is it a coffee with a guy who has a nice sweater or is it an influencer dinner i would hope that it's not it's none of the advice it's just i mean i wish it was all of those things it's a dinner but i thought i sometimes get the time wrong and unfortunately that does affect our recording time and i apologize for that just i mean just for my like self-hatred you know i just want it while i'm While I'm picking up dog shit before the gardener comes, because I won't have time to do it later, I just wanted to know what whiskey tasting you are at or what place you are asking if they have... dairy-free gelato or something wouldn't you i'm not that bad i would never get dairy-free gelato that that's right that's where i draw the line so walk me through your dinner please or has the dinner not happened yet no the didn't it's no no it's four it's four o'clock in the afternoon right okay or four yeah whatever almost five o'clock yeah no it's no it hasn't happened yet okay but now you have time to go to this dinner because of the adjustment of the calendar yes yes that's right okay yeah exactly yes that is 100 the facts of the matter Will I enjoy the dinner? Who's to say? That's always up for discussion. Well, what my goal is for the 15-minute intro of this podcast is to try to find as many ways as possible for you to not enjoy the dinner. Well, I'm not going to – I mean, you know I don't enjoy anything. So it's not really, it's not really, it's not, you don't have to. I want, I want this to be the dinner of a lifetime. I want every course to, I mean, to show up to be better than the last. I want this to rearrange the DNA and every thought that you've had about the dining industrial complex. And then I want to pull my trousers down and shit all over it. You know, I want you, I want me. to be in the back of your mind when you're having that oh is that fresh white truffle i don't think it's from the local region i'm looking at the menu as we speak and it does look delicious but it doesn't look like a restaurant for me really um it's leading with fried veal chop um no you know what i'm saying yeah actually bro i mean that's heavy even for me brother there's seven different i'm looking at this now there's seven different veal i swear to god veal there's another veal thing then there's veal tenderloin this is fucking crazy they eat horse

What the fuck are they doing over here? They do eat horse up in there. I've had it. Don't need to. So this is the Cosmic Retribution. Thank you, Italian Jesus, for presenting Chris with his seven-course veal tasting. Personal Italian Jesus. Grazie. Grazie. Oh, man. No, no. That's all fair. I mean, I feel pretty good. i was up for 24 hours yesterday a classic chris move so i i feel yeah when i left you down in in minnesota i was like this could be his last flight this is it no i mean it was fine the last i wanted the last thing our last words to possibly be me yelling as i go to gate or terminal g and you're in terminal f or whatever it was me yelling don't work out tomorrow and you saying fuck that and i wanted those to be our last that is that is how i should go and i i think that's a really a great way don't go down and you know it's like when the the fireman is like i gotta go back i hear i hear i hear a dog barking and they're like bro no no and then you run in there because it's your duty as a fireman and it's your duty as somebody who's replaced addiction with athletics. Exactly. No, it's true. You got to go down with the ship. I got, I'm happy to go down with the ship. I'm happy to go down with the ship. Okay. So you had, you were, you were up for 24 hours and that I was up for 24 hours. Yeah. What did we do to get our, um, recovery on? Uh, I slept for eight to nine hours and then did go to the gym, um, and kind of sweat it out. I believe there's a sauna, but I haven't ventured. I didn't have time. Um, but I'm going to look into that as well. You know, Italy, the recovery culture here is kind of another spritz. You know, they don't really, there's not, there's not a lot of, there's not a lot of recovery. What is this? They don't have a lot of kind of Huberman followers here. It's kind of the antithesis of their culture. So yeah, I'm the mouth is only being used for extortion, kidnapping, things like that.

Yeah, to tape my nose so I don't have to smell the onions while they're cooking. It's not for the way that we think of it. But look, I'm happy to be here. The weather's beautiful. I love Milan. So, you know, it's fine. It seems like there's a lot of people out there influencing in Milan right now. My Instagram feed is full of lawnfluencers. The me is silent. It's a pretty big, yeah. Is it a big city? I'll check it out. It's not a big city, actually. It's just a lot of, it's just. I mean, this is why I'm here and what I'm going to kind of write about is just like how these things happen, like how these sort of like industry forward. Like at one point, this has been around for 65 years or something. It was really for people that were in the furniture and interior industry only. You know what I mean? The way that CMJ was for music only or South by Southwest with people in the music business. Fashion shows were for buyers at clothing stores only. Yeah, exactly. The list goes on. And then they're like, oh, yeah. our democracy and economy has crumbled. Let's get the influencers up in here. But I don't even think it's that. I think it's more... Have you tried the 18-year Tullamore Dew? I think the brands are the ones that are like, wait, these people are cool and we can do something fun. And then... more of the types that you're talking about end up showing up. You know what I mean? It's like if we got to be here for this work trip anyway, let's at least invite our friends who are cool or use it as an opportunity to pay cool people to be forced to be our friends through commerce. There's not a lot of commerce happening. I'll say that for 100% fact. That is not what this is. It's more of a party hosted by Hermes. You know what I mean? It's like that kind of thing where it's like once you start. bringing in fashion and alcohol, all these, you know, they have different. If the, if the commerce is not happening to you, you are the commerce, as they say at Hermes. That's a good point. It'll hit you over the head. Yeah. But it's an interesting, it's an interesting group of people. Also, it's cool because there's no street style. So people aren't dressed like idiots. Like people just look normal. And I've only been to Milan during fashion stuff where people look like idiots. So it's nice to see just like John Pawson walking through the fucking lobby in a sweater.

You know what I mean? Instead of like, you know, somebody with Mickey Mouse ears on and like a polka dot com de garçon dress or whatever. So is it because this is more like interior design related? Is that why people feel like they can take a day off from dressing like Fonsworth Bentley? It's a different person. It's a different person altogether. Like they couldn't dress like Fonsworth if they wanted to. Got it. One of the most cold disses you've ever said. No one can. I don't mean to speak on the goat like that, obviously. That's one of my number ones. I'm sure there's a couple guys at the Uniqlo in San Francisco who are getting close. No, that's absolutely true. Absolutely true. We didn't talk about the influencer fight. I guess it's not an influencer fight. I guess it's Twitter personality. Twitter personality, AI-generated sumo wrestling fight. Dye Workwear challenged one of his haters to a fight in front of a Uniqlo in San Francisco, and they fought, and there's only this one clip that you brought to my attention, and it looks... I don't think it's actually fake, but it's so funny that it could be. Nobody has ever fought like that in the history of the world. Well, that's because these are two people that have never fought ever. and have never even seen a fight. So I think maybe they didn't know. They don't even know how to mimic. They invented a new, I mean, I guess it is sumo. It's basically two guys kind of half squatted down, and then their hands are sort of touching each other in the hip area. The idea of sumo is you try to push somebody out of the circle, and then you get a point, I think. But there was no circle, so it's just kind of, it seemed, if it is real, it's even worse. It should be AI generated. That's what my hope is. My hope is that, because I don't think that, I just don't think that this could be AI. I think these people are dumb enough to do this. You know what I mean? I think it's like nerds getting too pumped up and then realizing they have to do it, you know, to kind of prove themselves to their imaginary friends from Twitter. Not one punch was thrown, you know? Well, that's kind of, you know, there's a lot of fights where no punch they're thrown, but usually the people are drunk as hell.

You know, this was like a midday. This was like after church vibe. I guess. You know what I mean? Like this is like this is two guys. I feel like it takes more work and effort to actively get into a street fight where there are no rules. Unless ground rules were set and they said no striking. But it's usually, you know, kind of no biting, no hair pulling, no fish hooking. I think it was more we both have to do this because we. talk so much shit and neither of us wants to do it at all and why is that why if there's 500 people they're watching people made t-shirts for it thousands of people were supporting it on online why sway is there only one four second video of two guys kind of touching each other in the abdomen area maybe maybe it was like the bob dylan show they gave you the yonder pouch you know and it was like That's it. Actually, once you enter San Francisco at the airport, they give you a yonder pouch and they're like, you cannot film any. And don't even go to Oakland. You cannot film any of this because we're hanging on by a thread, brother. No shade to San Francisco. I love you guys over there. Your phone's going to get stolen in Oakland anyway. All right. We do have a guest today. David Owen from Idea Books. Great Brit is joining us. He looks to be wearing a cardigan today, which is nice. Great Brit. Let's cross the pond and get into it. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Squarespace. Obviously, Jason, you and I spend a lot of time on the World Wide Web, so do our peers, our listeners, our friends, our colleagues, maybe even your parents if they're freaky. And if you're doing anything in the world... writing, taking pictures. I do topless boxing. You need a website. Exactly. A website that works, that does what it's supposed to do, that allows you to be creative but also business-minded. Jason, there's one place to go for that, Squarespace. Yeah, Chris, I'm over here. I'm modifying calculators and putting Claude inside of them so you could cheat at school. And I just want a place where I could have everything all in one place. I can have the SEO tools.

So those future graduates can find me and, you know, I'm able to accept, quote unquote, donations for my services that might be gray area. You know what I mean? And then email campaigns. Hey, I got a new, you know, 2.3 version upgrade. Boom, boom, boom. Get the analytics going. Raise some money. You know, show your investor all of your cool analytics of what's going on. They're going to want to get in early and we can use Blueprint AI to make your website look as professional. as your competition, if not more. So head to squarespace.com slash howlong for a free trial. When you're ready to launch, use offer code howlong to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or a domain. All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Quince. Jason, the temps are warming up. It's getting hot out there. Summer always changes how I get dressed. I need pieces that feel lighter, more breathable. And they're just easy, but still put together. I don't want to look like a slob. That's why I keep coming back to Quince. They focus on high-quality essentials that feel and look amazing. Breathable linen and soft organic cottons. Well-made basics, but without the luxury markups. That rare balance where everything feels elevated. but still effortless. Yeah, Chris, linen season is here. I wore a linen blazer to dinner a few nights ago in the warm California sun. But, you know, you got that Italy trip coming up this summer and quality European linen pants and shirts. Upgrade that look starting at just $34. You know, if you get a nice linen suit, a little t-shirt underneath it, some chill shoes, you're looking good, but you're staying cool. The inside of your special areas are nice and dry as you turn up with your besties. So elevate that summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com slash how long for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns, even on a nice holiday now available in Canada. That is Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash how long. That'll get you free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince punto com slash how long. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by a new podcast from The Guardian stateside with Kai and Carter. This is covering a lot of our bases, Jason. It's trying to slow down.

The news and wrestle with the questions we all have about what's happening in the world. And I know you particularly have quite a lot of questions. A lot of questions. But how often? Because we do this podcast three times a week and that's a sweet spot. How many times do they do? Three times a week. And I have a feeling just based on the platform and these talking points that they're maybe going to be covering different stuff than we do. That's just a guess. The Guardian is not some billionaire owned. They're not afraid to say what they want to say, brother. Yeah, Rupert ain't sniffing around in what journalists Kai Wright and Carter Sherman are up to over there at Stateside. But yeah, listen wherever you get your podcasts. You can watch it on YouTube. It's three times a week. And who couldn't use more news? Especially when it's not from here, let's say. Give it a listen. Give it a listen. Well, if it makes you feel better, it's entertaining hearing you be mildly annoyed at technical things. Just hearing you whisper bloody hell under your breath is comforting. Is it like Mr. Bean with dialogue? Yes, exactly. I didn't want to go there, but yeah, kind of. You're the Bean of books, many have said, right? Either that or it gets to the John Cleese bit where he goes and attacks his car with the branch. I can't remember where that's from. That feels... I mean, that feels Monty Python-y. No, it's later. Okay. Fawlty Towers? Well, Fawlty Towers does that, like, farcically quite well. But then he made this whole other movie long before A Fish Called Wanda. He made a movie in the late 70s or something like that, where things just went disastrously badly over and over again. But at one point, his car breaks down and won't start, and he just... annihilates it with a really big branch he gives it a right good thrashing one could say yeah with a with a branch like a okay so like a tree just waste from the ground just and it's a shit car in a shit british street anyway and the movie was not a big hit okay but i forgot what it's called i think people don't love to see things going wrong over and over either reminds them of their own lives too much maybe oh wow do you because i don't know that

The genre is like, I'm trying to think of an example now where something I've turned off or walked out of because I'm like, oh, it's one of those. And it's really popular. Yeah, I feel like it's more popular where you are. I feel like there's a lot of films that are called the increasingly difficult life of Sir blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know what I mean? We had a long-running sitcom called Ever Decreasing Circles, and I never watched an episode because I just thought... Ever decreasing circles is a really cool name. What a poetic, beautiful name, though. I love it. Beautiful name. Sounds like a Tool album. I wish. You a big Tool listener? I, you know, there are things that, yes, there's music that comes on that I definitely listen to. And Tool has been one of those. But it was one of the few things where I couldn't guess who the hell we were listening to. when it came on yeah yeah sure yeah of course to give you a guide from where i start if spotify keeps just playing tool would come in about 27 hours later okay yeah but it wouldn't not come in yeah for me it would not come in i think which is proud i i hate tool i really hate tool no i'd get there but but because it would miss me It would misread some signs. Do you see what it means? Of course. The algorithm isn't perfect. And also, Chris, your algorithm has heard you say the word tool featuring Maynard James Keenan in the band Tool. Yes. He has a great, you know, enema. What an album. You know, the band is Tool. So I'm just trying to say it as many times. So on hour 24 to 37. It'll pick up. You'll get a stink fist in there. Yep.

I did know, I am familiar with Maynard James Keenan as a triple name threat. I'm aware of him, but not his musical stylings that much. More his winemaking. I get it. We have a, in the company, and there's only like eight of us, but we, it's simple for us to have like one sign in with Chrome so that you can have the bookmarks and lists and things that was useful to everybody. But if people forget. to go on private browsing that's like eight people who are going to receive emails except that's where and we get um this toe fungus email that we can't get rid of for maybe six years now so somewhere and it wasn't it wasn't actually me but someone deep down in the past it wasn't me it wasn't me definitely googled they just googled what do i what do i do if i've got fungus between my toes It's there. And it won't ever... Yeah, you have to be pretty careful. I guess in terms of all the things that are protected by private browsing, a little fungus email is pretty low on the totem pole in terms of incriminating Google searches. That's actually true. Yeah, it's exactly... From what I've heard from other people. And I use chat... I can never say it right. I always say GBT, which claims that we have something to do with it, but we don't. It's going to be PT. And I use that a lot, like when I'm writing, but I'm only ever writing things involving crime and sexual misdemeanors. Sure. You know, generally awkward things. And I always have to explain to chat to PT that, you know, this is for a script. And this is fiction. This is fiction. Don't send the cops. And it's very respectful. And if I sometimes forget to. precedes what i'm saying with the this is for in a film you know if you were writing a script if i don't do that i then get like a warning notice telling me that this is the sort of stuff that it's not going to be talking to me about is what it does really so hold on you're saying that if you preempt it by saying this is for a script

it's fine and if you don't it you get a warning and it was really good it wastes a bit of time um for itself which is all right by saying on the proviso that you've told me that this is for a script that and this is how you would perform there was one where i had to it's a neat little scene but like someone who is a doctor has come into this flat where they have an aquarium and then the person there is as um overdosed and he's wants to give him a stomach pump and I had to basically I just twist chat GPT until it agrees with me so I go how would you perform a stomach pump at home with like just the pipe from an aquarium I see I see and it goes no that isn't going to work you know clearly and I go I don't know and I say back to it I don't think you've thought this through have you and And then it goes, well, hmm. And I say, what exact is the millimeter diameter of the typical tube that someone would perform a stomach pump? And it goes, it's like six mil or something. And I go, and what is it on, you know, the average American hot water aquarium? And it goes, oh, six mil. And I go, so you see? And it goes, okay. So now the next. Wow. I didn't know. I guess I didn't realize how interactive it was. Jason, did you realize that? I didn't realize that. I haven't. Now you've got to pay for the. But I like that you have figured out a way to sort of gaslight and manipulate AI technology into coming around to your line of thinking. It's beautiful. But also, it seems like it's fun to have these arguments or conversations with chat GPT. I used to do that with a phone call. Or like, would you like to take this survey or like the little chat on a website when it's like I'm trying to return something and they're not letting me. And I'm like, hello, how are you today? And I'm like, hey, how are you? And then you just like start talking to a robot for 20 minutes just from the artistic standpoint of it. But it's much more advanced now. So what do you think a Stephen King would think about you?

asking chat gpt all these uh all these questions about the writing process you know somebody who would believe that this is a form of uh bowling with the bumpers up in the gutters you know what i mean i think i'm doing it because this sounds ridiculous but um there's a creative writing app that comes with it when you pay for it and um which i i did i've never used for the purposes of you know, I'm trying to write this commercial. Could you fill in the next two pages? Do you know what I mean? And then I go home early. I don't use it for that because I've seen what it can do and it's appalling. However, it says it can kind of like correct and perhaps, you know, like give you some handy hints or something like it's very friendly. Handy hints. If it's not too much trouble, David, I've got some handy hints for you. Yeah, exactly. So just for the sheer hell of it. And this sounds ridiculous, whatever. And also bear in mind, like I'm not the most successful writer. So it's not like this is coming from like Stephen King's position for anything. Anyway, so there is a bit that I wrote a scene because it can't take a whole screenplay, but it could take a scene. And I did know that the scene, in my opinion, was perfect. And I just thought, fuck it, I'll copy and paste that then and see what it thinks. And so I copy and paste it and put it in there and it thinks for like a split second and then comes back with detailed notes. And it said, well, you know, there really isn't anything to be added to this. You've set this up perfectly, the introduction of this character and that character. And there are two opposing points of view and the way it comes out and the joke when it's revealed is really funny. And the whole thing's generally enlightening. We've made some minor changes, which when I looked at them, they just took where I'd written there. and put they are, which I had to change back. Which one could argue is incorrect. But what I wanted, perhaps more than anything in the world, is validation and approval. So then are you able to take that feedback and then send it in an email to the person that rejected your first draft or whatever? They love that.

I wonder if that's going to happen in the future as people are submitting scripts and screenplays to be the next White Lotus or whatever it is. The way you can get a diamond ring certified by a professional, are people going to say, hey, or a wine score, I ran this through ChatGBT, it gave me a 93. You'd be a fool to turn this script down. I think they'd possibly already do this to the point where some people probably do. chuck scripts actually they definitely do i've read about it i just don't like it but yeah they throw scripts into these uh analyses ai analysis yeah they do it with songs too yeah it's like is this going to be it it's the new form of sort of uh you know a test audience let's say that feels more exacting i would guess yeah but it seems like you're using it for the right the right way which i've heard other people talk about where you know have it do all the menial tasks that make writing not as fun, you know, do everything but the creative part where the words are coming from your mind. But you can say, like, you know, I want to write about this subject. Here's my notes. How would you organize these chapters? If I wanted to convey these two points, what would it be? You know, that kind of stuff. Yeah, I use it. It's a shortcut through Google and the rest of the Internet. So because it does a clever. search which uh and gets you the right result quicker so basically i have it constantly open if i'm writing and trying to write fast and then you really can motor along and also i like in um it's probably a fault of mine but i like in films where things are kind of uh at least plausible and then you do fantastic things with it but you do it with reality or at least what could have been achieved and then the person who does it is more heroic or more inspired or more of a lunatic because you could actually have done that but it was life risking or whatever and but what i like about so i did i have a script where some um they're russian terrorists and bad guys and they're

in los angeles they actually the extraordinary thing about this script is that they actually have this is contentious by the way sorry but um they actually i'll be the judge of that yeah they have all of la's homeless are not homeless they're sleeper cells russian sleeper cells uh okay so so we're in the middle of a la has a catastrophic unhoused crisis tens of thousands sleeping on the streets, and they're all soldiers of Mother Russia waiting for their orders to flip out of their cardboard box and start taking prisoners, I'm assuming. This is a rewrite of a British version, and in the British version, all of those really expensive... The British version, they're Turkish, but otherwise it's an A-B comp. They were still Russian bad guys, but in the British version, all of their expensive property sitting empty, which is a real buzz thing for us over here, was not empty. They're housing Russian sleepers. And then when I had to rewrite it for L.A., I just couldn't resist that homeless army because they all get moaned down at the end. woman driving a van through um up to Griffith Park I know it's gold because it's basically I know it's hilarious and it that's why I've got it and it what's incredible about it is I've made it so that she does not kill Anyone who hasn't aimed a gun or fired a gun or a rocket launcher at her or is coming wildly to attack her with a knife or something like that. It's all self-defense is what you're saying. Well, no, it just means retaliation. No, this is how you're going to get that PG-13 rating. Smart. Yeah, smart. It's just it's just important for the audience that this woman is not just she kills a lot. In fact, and in fact, it turns out that she.

that she, at the end of the movie, there's a little... Yeah, that's right. She. Yeah. No, it's not why she's a woman, but she's a plumber. But anyway, at the end, it turns out... Okay, now I know it's bullshit. They ain't got no female plumbers in LA. Maybe Pittsburgh. Actually, no, all the way around. Female plumbers only in LA. Go ahead, David. I'm sorry. It turns out that she'd... And I checked this with GPT as well. She had like a kill count of like 80. And it turns out that is the highest... kill count on american soil since like the actual uh revolution you know the civil war so you're breaking records already you're you're kind of breaking records anyway the point being i told i wanted to know because they signal to the all the homeless the signal is that they blow up the griffith park observatory and they can see it, all of the homeless across the whole of L.A., from the top of whatever. You can see it both ways. This is going to be an expensive movie to make, but go ahead, go ahead. I don't care what bridge you're living under. You're going to see that thing go up. Yeah, CGI is the answer to that. Of course, of course, of course. Anyway, so then on Google Maps, I look down, and it's important. Basically, I then got Jack GPD to tell me various things, like if... Well, what size are the rockets that they've got in that observatory? Because, you know, they've got model rockets of all of the things that have gone into space from America, whatever. I wanted to know the exact size of them. And then I needed to know, like, if they were a detonator underneath them, bang, like this, would they, how far would they fly? Because it's a great scene at this point. They're mashing and killing all of these homeless people. And over the top of them, it's like the Apollo rocket is just, it's great. So, and the bust of James Dean, like, bang, into the air. That's good. That's good. Iconic. There's a lot going on. Anyway, so I then looked on Google Maps, and not at the bottom, but, like, in this area, at the bottom of Griffith Park, it's called, you know, where people, it's nice, swanky people live there. It's lovely. I've forgotten what it's called. Los Feliz. Los Feliz.

exactly yeah so just right by the entrance there is one like house with a swimming pool and that's where the the other protagonist or whatever like that was having a house party and you know whatever and they invited the chief of police because it's a bit like the end of ace ventura or something Definitely the chief of police is there, and so is the local planning manager. They're all at Aziz's house in Los Feliz, is what you're saying. I know that you know him, and so do we. He's a lovely customer of ours. He knows nothing about this, because we don't talk about what he actually does. Because he doesn't use a phone, and he just stands there with a notepad, an actual pen. and writes down inspirations. And I was like, that's the sign of someone who doesn't want to go off for a few hours and jam with me about my movie. And then you write down on the receipt an extra zero because it's Aziz and say it'll be $700 for that Ibiza book. Not at all. That one's $1,200, actually. That one's $1,200. Oh, that one, that is $1,200. I get confused because we get numerous people from America who have a single name their name series on hulu and things like that and i don't know who any of them are some of the people like a rammy or something is what you're saying he comes yeah i knew he's lovely lovely guy but he's a single name he's a madonna if you will yeah not a lot of guys called steve who are doing going for that angle okay well hey on this i had one note on this scene or a couple follow-up questions Number one, do you need an advisor, a script partner, anyone who can – because I'm an L.A. guy, so I'd love to – Fill in some colors. He should read that one. He can read it, but we can talk about the fee after. Just kind of having his eyes on it is going to cost something. I'll tell you what I'm going to do right now. I made notes. I wrote down the list of the names of my friends because I'm very bad at remembering the title of this movie and who's in this movie or this book or that, whatever. So I thought I would just write down the names of my friends. So I've done that, but separately.

This guy called Mark Cullen, you know who he is? No. Do you know who Aidan Cullen is? The photographer. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Aidan Cullen turns out to be the son of Mark Cullen. And Mark Cullen came into our store with his girlfriend. They have very white teeth. And I said something. I was working in the store early on a Saturday. I said something flippant to him. And he said something flippant back. And people with Hollywood white teeth don't normally do that. So I was immediately engaged. You know, this guy has humor. And so I go. Just to be clear, calling somebody or saying somebody has white teeth is a derogatory remark where you're from. It's just a point of difference to my own. Sure. At the very least. Sure. I've just I've what have I done with my teeth? I've just earmarked that money for other things. There's no reason why I shouldn't have nice teeth. It's just low on the priority list compared to other things. Big David Bowie fan. Oh, this is huge for me personally. This episode of How I'm Gone is brought to you by TaskRabbit. Oh, baby, let me tell you something. This is not a joke. I use TaskRabbit a lot. because I can't do anything. You need some art hung? TaskRabbit. You need something put together? A cabinet? Got to reach that cheese grater on the top shelf? TaskRabbit. Anything you need, TaskRabbit can take care of it for you. How it works, TaskRabbit connects you with skilled taskers in your area. They can help you move. They can assemble furniture, repairs, yard work, mounting, and more. You can search for a tasker based on cost, skill set, availability, and past client reviews so you know exactly who's showing up and can have confidence that they know what they're doing because taskers have assembled over 3.4 million pieces of furniture, completed 700,000 home repairs. handled 1.5 million moves, and the numbers are just going up, Jason. Yeah, throw a little money at the problem. It's not so expensive, and that job that you really don't want to do is something that another person out in the world is very good at doing and would gladly do it in exchange for a little bit of money. So when life happens, your to-do list grows. Get ahead of it now and get $15 off your first task at TaskRabbit.com

how long taskers book up faster, especially for same day tasks. So book trusted home help today. That is $15 off your first task using promo code how long with the TaskRabbit app or at TaskRabbit.com. Hi Talk House Network listeners, it's your old friend Nels Klein from Wilco here. Wilco is touring this summer and we'd love to see you somewhere on the road. We're playing shows this June and July in Rochester Hills, Michigan, Chautauqua, New York, Lafayette, New York, Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, Vienna, Virginia, Forest Hills, New York, Portland, Maine, Tulsa, Oklahoma, Memphis, Tennessee, La Grange, Georgia, Charleston, South Carolina, Virginia Beach, Virginia, Wheeling, West Virginia, and Columbus, Ohio. Plus, there are even more dates, some with Willie Nelson that I didn't even mention here. So please go to wilkoworld.net to see the full list of dates. We'll see you on the road this summer. At HSBC UK, when you invest in your business, we're invested too. Whether it's borrowing to buy new equipment... To invest in energy saving or in new technology, we cut through the noise with our sector specialists, regional expertise and tailored finance solutions. So if you're looking to grow your business, we lend more than money. To get insights on how UK businesses are borrowing for growth, search HSBC Business Finance. Lending is subject to status, eligibility criteria and T's and C's apply. the thing that he said in some magazine but my friend justin hawkins old friend who uh is the darkness lead singer he had he had the worst teeth ever and then um and then he just went away like after the first album they sold two million records or something he came back with his fucking perfect teeth and someone in a magazine someone on the sun or something like that went hey well you know you sold out you've gone and got the hollywood teeth he just said it looked like i've been necking turds

And that was in the sun. Fair point. The girl from White Lotus had some crazy quote about, like, she called her teeth Nashers. Oh, yeah. She's like, why are you guys so focused on my Nashers? You don't use that one, Nashers? Yeah, that's good. I'm going to now, even though it's definitely stolen valor, but that's a great way to describe it. Yeah, but I would argue, you know, it's all about subtlety. If you are the type of person whose Nashers look as if you've been necking turds, You know, the teeth white spectrum is a spectrum. And somebody who has, you know, by British standards, terrible teeth, which is very, very low. Just, you know, we don't need a perfect 10. Get a nice 6.7. I feel like you should be able to bring in kind of like a Pantone swatch and be like, this is what I want. There has to be imperfections. We have to add grain to photography and bump. up and down the shadowing. I want film photography teeth, not digital photography teeth. I was having this convo yesterday with my wife, and I think you've talked about it before as well, Chris, but the only real excuse is if you have immeasurable oral emergencies, like you look like you've been mashing turds, you've got a black tooth, you lose your teeth, you know, some sort of gum disease. Or if you're on television, if you're a weatherman or hosting the news every day, then that's fine. Otherwise, just do a regular tooth. Don't go full white. I have a friend. I'm not going to say who it is, but they're reversing. Like when people have tattoos removed, this person, not even going gender, is... Way to pat yourself on the back there, David. Oh, he's good. Listeners, take note. This is a master of the fucking pro. I've got notes. But they are having... This is like me on the whole trans thing. They are...

The whole trans thing's groovy, man. Yeah. Having them made less white is all I was going to say. That's all they're doing. It's like... Downsizing. Downgrading their... It's like a breast reduction, like you said. It's what I try to do to my personality, but it doesn't seem to stick. I totally get it. And I think it's good that you are magnifying these brave voices and characters because the thought of doing that seems like an instrument... Because you've already gone through the trauma of having every single one of your teeth... shaved down into horror movie spikes and then spent, you know, tens of thousands of dollars to have these teeth put in. Imagine undoing all of that and going through the whole. I mean, obviously, you don't have to grind down your teeth again, but the finance, you know, it's tough and it takes some soul searching to do that. And more people need to downgrade and have some shittier looking regular teeth. Is this going into one of your adverts? No, no, no. We don't have. No, because you were getting into the... What I like about the ads on your show is that you have a weird swing rhythm to the way that you deliver them. The way you're doing that is, well, yeah, but then you're getting in the swing of this. Yeah, there's a certain way to speak when you do an ad that I think we both discovered pretty quickly. Yeah, you've done a lot of commercial work. You want to try to hypnotize the viewer or listener into consuming this amazing product that we are pushing. Yeah, because we're selling lies, you know, so we got to make sure it comes across as very, very real. Well, a couple of segues that I wanted to move into in terms of commercial work, but one last question about it. the Griffith Park finale scene. When that's all happening, Griffith Park explodes, the rockets are shooting off into space, countless unhoused people are being murdered. What is the needle drop song for this? I already know you got one. Oh, no, I don't. No, I don't. I think it should be a David Bowie of some sort. Heroes? It can't be Muno's Daydream because they borrowed that for the...

You know, that popular one on a cassette. See, I can't remember the title of films, but you know who I'm talking about. Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's an awful trend in cinema now where they'll take an old song. I was thinking maybe Oh You Pretty Things would be a good song to play as the world is exploding, but they'll do a version where it's like a down-tempo, kind of Portishead dubstep version, and they'll have a woman whisper singing the lines instead of... I don't want to be mean to people who do covers of songs. That's very broad. But Will, they stop fucking slowing them down. I think it's strictly because it makes it easier. Right, because you think they're reading the music while they're doing the new Boots Christmas commercial, and they haven't quite got the hang of, like... It's trying to slow down. I think it makes it more cinematic. It creates tension. I was thinking more of when someone's on, like, BBC doing the cover, you know, and they often slow it down as well. Like when they cover a contemporary song. It just simply makes it easier. Contemporary artists. They're all doing it. And I really like that. It seems like it. There's a few that I really like. Who did it? Chan Marshall. What's her thing? Cat Power. Cat Power. And another customer. So hello. And she did the Dylan album, and I really liked it. But what I will say is, could she just not do one quicker? Just one of them. Speed it up a little bit. Let's hit that tempo. She slowed down every single one. And then practically everybody who does these re-record things for movies and for commercials, that's their whole thing. I would occasionally you hear, if you can think of a quick cover.

I would like to know because they're fairly rare. I feel like in like 90s teen movies when the economy was strong under Bill Clinton, we had a lot of faster sped up pop punk versions of like 80s songs. Yeah, like a Blink-182 version. I think we're alone now. What about that kind of stuff? That's actually true. But now that our world has crumbled, it's slower. Do you think Lemonheads, Mrs. Robinson is Quirica? Yes. I don't know. It could be, isn't it? Yeah, I think so. Breakneck pace. Yeah, the 90s, we did faster covers because that was the last era before computers took over and software and benzos and sedative cough syrups. Hip-hop music used to be about having fun and partying and dancing, and now it's about taking a nap on drugs. Donnie Darko is the one that screwed it. That tears for fears or whatever it was. Slow down. That also kept the darkness off number one in the UK. Mad World. Mad World. That's a famous cover, too. That was beloved. I know it's beloved, but that's where they do that once and everyone's like, this is wonderful. It doesn't mean that for 20 more years we have to have slowed down versions of songs. That Mad World in Donnie Darko, that could have been the inception point of taking a song that is already perfect. The weird bit is the slower you go, the less you get into a 30. second commercial, but still they try. It must be... Two bars and you're out. I think they must be thinking it evokes more emotion. That must actually be the reason. There's a certain gravitas and respect to the artist, the original artist, that their song is worthy of becoming a ballad, even though it was an old skiffle tune by Lonnie Donovan. For example, when Luke Combs covers Michelle... Or Tracy Chapman, excuse me. That is... that's respectful, in my opinion. You know what I mean? I think a cover should be handled like a karaoke song. Don't do it unless you have it perfectly memorized and you don't have to look at the music or the lyrics. Unless you're able to just close your eyes and play it perfectly and sing it perfectly, you shouldn't fuck around with it. My favorite one. Especially a hip-hop song. But it's not quicker, is it? I don't know why. Emma.

The Sisters of Mercy cover of Hot Chocolates Ammo. That's my favorite cover of all time. Wow, I'm not familiar with that. That one, they just took a very intense and dramatic song and made it really intense and dramatic. I mean, that you wouldn't have thought was... Leaned in. Oh, my God, yeah. That's an incredible thing. But you should check that one out because that is an extraordinary piece of music. That sounds like a DJ there. I'll needle drop it into the episode, don't worry. Well, on the subject of script writing and commercials and adverts and things like that, I was watching this documentary film on the plane that was about a guy who was originally a documentary filmmaker. up-and-coming indie music lover, blah, blah, blah. And then he eventually started doing commercial work, and then that sort of took over his whole career. And the film is called Flipside, which is a name that you have used for Flipside TV, which was a TV show you had 20, 25 years ago, early 2000s. This is incredible that it's that old, isn't it? All that is to say you're very old. Any questions or comments about that? No, no, but are you familiar with this? It seems like there's a lot of similarities because you're an artistic guy who's done a lot of stuff, but then I know a lot of artistic guys who do a lot of stuff, but then do... a little commercial work on the side, and the money's real good, and it's easy, and it's easy to just sort of... Well, one thing about David, Jason, that you'll learn is that he likes making money. And I think he is not... He is much like us. He is down to do what it takes, is what it feels like, within reason. Yeah. And he also knows that you have to do one for them, one for you. He has a rich editorial landscape in his day-to-day life.

I'll look at the rate card, but you could do ads for Idea as well. We should do one at one point because it would be fantastic. By the way, on those ads, my favorite ever thing was when I was living in L.A. a bit and that station, is it K-Rock, the one that just plays the Rocky song, Eye of the Tiger, every 45 minutes. Don't forget Red Hot Chili Peppers and Social Distortion. Those are kind of the real. I actually hate that. the rest of the playlist i really like but what i loved is like the ads were obviously unbearable really and it was like your style with the dj but and you might get three in a row but then this company who i think sold carpets had obviously gone we're going to have real impact if we just block book the three and take a 15 minute section for a while when i was living there He was great, the DJ, but he would do 15 minutes on one carpet store and went into the pile and how deep the pile was and other things about how you wouldn't be getting electric shocks if you were running a certain type of vacuum across. I mean, good. It was 15 minutes. And I thought, yeah, I mean, that was pretty good. That was the best of those I heard. After a while, even though I'd heard it before, I quite liked it. And because he was... often reading, you know, like not just once. Yeah, there would be fluctuation and changes in it. It's pretty good. And 15 minutes is so long that if there was a terrorist attack, it'd have to break and go to the news and come back, finish it. If there was trouble at the old observatory, we'd have to probably break for news. In Atlanta, there's like all the hip-hop stations do that. Like the advertisers on the hip-hop stations make songs that sound like current hip-hop and R&B hits. to advertise a car dealership or a lawyer or whatever it is. That is the highest level of creativity. I was going to say, do they find that very difficult to make those kind of R&B things here? They literally get a fake usher to come into the studio and talk about an ambulance-chasing lawyer in the same tone. Auto-tune. Auto-tune tone. I could probably do one of those songs, to be honest. Get a dig up, Ben. Okay.

Well, going back going back to Flipside TV, I wanted you to sort of talk about that a little bit because it's to me like right now we're living in a reactionary media landscape. You know, like our podcast exists because we are reacting to things that are happening in the world. Everyone on TikTok is posting a video of their face on top of, you know, the White Lotus finale or a restaurant review. or a political event to show how they're reacting and to make it about them. And you guys did a show where it was just three funny people scrolling the television and reacting to it in real time. Is that what went down? I haven't seen it myself. And there are clips on YouTube and some absolutely great clips. It was dead for a while and then a few people found bits to resurrect. There's one segment called Live Bumming. which is a title that I still wanted to use. Be careful there. They're watching cage wrestling or whatever you call it, cage fighting. But they called it, mainly because one of the people on the show said the phrase, but that's what they called it. Now people can look for it, the YouTube one. It's very funny. But we had a... well to start with i had this thing around 2000 where because i had lots of ideas all the time um which is not why ideas called idea but anyway i do and then so i started a website very early website called idea a day doesn't exist anymore uh which got very popular in the uk and i just wrote like an original idea and then just put it for free out on the it was like went out by email to more and more people every day And then I got other people to help with it. And then my friend Chaz wrote one idea, which was for his idea was for a human EPG, which you might be more familiar with that than even I was, but electronic program guide. So what they used to, we would have on Sky or whatever, like scrolling all the time on it. Always had music by, see, I know when I'm not going to be able to remember the name.

And there you go. He's got a beard and he's French and he plays like the keyboard, a bit like Jean-Michel Jarre, but hipster. Oh, I know who that is. And I'll look it up while you're talking. Sebastian, somebody. Anyway, his song was like constantly on rotation on the EPG. Anyway, so my friend's idea was to have a human EPG, a channel where you'd go to this channel and there would be somebody there who, instead of you scrolling to see what's on, he would go, hey. Now, in 30 seconds time, if you want to switch over to Bravo, you're going to see like, you know, when cops get arrested themselves or whatever, you know, this kind of vibe. And then which was a very good idea. Full stop. And then it morphed and evolved. And then some people got involved in doing it. And then there was a very strange TV studio in Wapping in London, which was putting out. things like avigo bingo and other call-in bingo channels and also was the home of babe station which was the equivalent of a modern cams girl internet thing but on the telly babe babe station now we're talking that's a good name these kind of things and um it was very low rent indeed and we started it on channel like i used to know it used to be called that as well channel 412 or 847 or something like that to give you. That's how far down the list is. And this was the first time the UK even had this multi-channel world. You had it for years in America, but anyway, this is what we had. So when you're in a hotel room and you get the little thing and you're scrolling down, it's all the channels. Exactly that. It's called Nation 757 or something like that, which sounds like a hooligan. Sounds like a White Stripe song. Yeah, yeah. It sounds like a nationalist youth movement. What color Fred Perry would they wear if they had the option to, David? All of them wear pink because the hardest ones are those ones and you just run a mile if you see them coming to me. If they're hard enough to wear pink, it's like Chappelle's joke about the one white guy and the black guy. Do you know what I mean? It's a real boy named Sue scenario. Yeah, you see a football hooligan who can rock pink clothes, just get out of there. Turn the other way.

Yeah, because he's killed a lot of people already. I've murdered and I will do it again. Exactly. Anyway, the point being, so we made this show. Yeah. And it literally went live. And there's a British television presenter called Richard Bacon who famously had been kicked off our kids program, Blue Peter, for being caught doing cocaine. And then came back to be quite cool and now works in America and lives in the bird streets and Hollywood and is on one of your programs right now. But anyway, at the time he did, he presented this show and then we got three people every night to sit in with him, including extraordinary people like, well, Markie Smith did one of the fall. And this is live. And I, at that time, I used to just. They would sit watching three TVs and I would stand on the other side of the three televisions and pout about. No cans, no walkie-talkie, basically useless to anybody. But I felt like I was... Doing some hand signals? Definitely a lot of hand signals and things. Marky Smith actually threatened to kill... or have uh christian o'connell who was the presenter from x radio to have him killed live on live on air going out with that's good that's good tv that's good tv baby yeah he actually threatened to have him killed and but there is a clip of marky smith on youtube but not that one uh it was earlier in the episode and it's absolutely astonishing basically what would happen is that the presenter would just if we were live for two hours a night five days a week for about that's a recipe for disaster yeah that's two years and then we went to channel four and then got chucked off channel four because keith allen uh offended ala that's lily's lily's dad correct lily's dad uh who is a lily's dad offended

the god Allah and had a network fatwa put on his head yeah but he managed to do it while watching motor racing which was also one of the few things that broke our in criticism and review fair dealing thing the reason why we could show all these television programs live anyway right because that was the great innovation of it so they would be watching the tv and then when someone starts talking about a show you would flip the show up to the plasma screen which was between them all And then they could turn their attention jointly to the plasma screen and commentate over live television. But the only one that you should never muck around with is sports. And so, one, he upset them because he... But it was very funny what he did with Formula One or whatever. It was the cars were driving around and he was... I don't know. He did it as a couple of... This is going to go down badly now. See, I start telling anecdotes sometimes and realize that they just get progressively worse. You're like, I can't say this, actually. I can't say what he said. Once you remember the rest of the anecdote, you're like, oh, this isn't good enough to say out loud. We're going to pull this back. Yeah, it's not just, yeah, I do that quite a lot. I do that. I've started this story and now I've remembered that. What I usually, I don't remember that the story is bad. What I remember is the memory of telling it to someone like two months ago and it going wrong. Yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? So the actual story might. I remember why I don't tell the story anymore while I'm in the middle of telling the story. Because I am not so good at telling it. But Markie Smith's fantastic one, utterly amazing one, was he has British references in this, but we'll try and make it work. So Christian O'Connor would go like, oh, Mark, what have you got there? And then Mark's supposed to go, well, I'm watching whatever. And then you put up on the plasma screen. It's like for live TV, it's quite easy to. You know, it didn't go wrong very often, that sort of thing. And Mark just goes like, well, it's not, I don't know if I can do his voice. It's not what I've got at home. And he went, right, it's live, so he's trying to keep it moving, whatever. And what do you have at home? He goes, well, I've got this set-top box from Aldi. And Aldi is the cheapest supermarket.

Yes, we actually do know. That might be true in America, too. Yeah, we're getting the Aldis here. It's a German conglomerate. Don't get the sushi from Aldi, is what they say. Classic. It's a Marky Smith. Yeah, I got the set-top box from Aldi. And Christian's like, right, yeah. And what have they got on there? He goes, well, they've got this one where it's just... It's a car just driving down the road. It's just driving and it just keeps driving down, you know, the road and you just keep, you know, you just watch and you're just looking out the wind. It's just driving and it goes on for hours. And it was that quiet afterwards. You've got to be able to. The opposite of yes and was going on. Marky, not a master of improv. He says, I can't watch all of this TV. You know what I mean? Like cop shows and casualties. So I get enough of that during the day as it is. I live it. And then half an hour later. threatened to have him killed like proper. I was very proud of that. Was this back when you could still smoke on television? We could have done, but we didn't because not many people did. He would have been smoking then. But no, you weren't supposed to. No, you shouldn't have done. It wasn't like those amazing ones where you watch Oliver Reed and Peter Cook. Unbelievable. Going on those chat shows and just smoking all the way. But you have them too, because I've watched them on YouTube, all the old American smoking clips and things. It's pretty dynamic. It's still shocking to see, kind of, in that setting, like on a TV set, to see somebody smoking a cigarette on like a chat show. Well, Johnny Carson, I mean, that's... yeah yeah that's that's bigger than any sort of british version of these late like smoking shows johnny carson yeah you i mean you see people go on on a show for the first time they're so nervous and the energy and they're standing with the stick up their ass and just i really would like to see them just light up a nice yep american spirit or whatever it is and just slink back down into their chair a little bit and get comfortable they don't actually have that you have more time on this than

Yeah, that's true. Any TV show is ever going to give anyone. People have smoked. I would say we've had more vaping probably than actual smoking. Yeah, we've had a decent amount of smoking, some marijuana use. No other drugs, really, I don't think, as far as I know. Only when you do coke, but you bend down, so you can't tell. Let's talk about, and also, I think there needs to be an idea a day example. Do you have an example from, because it seems like you were really on the precipice of all these big ideas and concepts. And you were just a little too early to market. That seems to be your blessing and curse in life. But I'd like to know some of these ideas that you had. It's not in my blessing and curse in life. I hope the weird thing was, it's like 500 ideas in that book. And now if you look back at it, like there are about 200 of them actually exist. So and that was not because we were so amazing. It's because we wrote it before. smartphones and we wrote it before apps and before the internet 2.0 in fact it was done before the dot-com bubble burst so there are a lot of things in it i mean i had one that i i've never seen and now possibly as redundant but i loved it so much and i never did any of them apart from the tv show and then i robbed some of them for um fiction later you know like uh just jokes that people make that are actually ideas that we'd have anyway the the one that i loved i thought of now is a golf game i don't know whether you vibe with golf or however you put it but anyway it was i vibe with golf it's a text game There's always going to be texted commands, obviously, because there's no pictures. It's that early on with phones. It's a Nokia game, if you like. So you would text it and you could choose the course that you want to play. So let's say it says, oh, you want to play Augusta because that's timely or whatever at the moment or whatever. So you go, yep, I'm going to play Augusta. And it would go, OK, I don't know the actual stats, but it would go first hole, 450 yards to the pin.

uh whatever like this wind conditions etc etc and you would text back and go three w for three wood and then you would go strength 100 and you would go slice five or whatever like that and you send a text with these instructions and immediately it would bounce you back a text going you are 320 yards from the hole flying in the soft rough whatever this sort of thing and you'd be like Okay, here we go. And then basically you have to play blind golf. Yeah, I was just going to say it was golf for the blind. Blind golf. And I have a sneaking suspicion that back in those days that that would actually have been tremendously popular and gentlemen probably at the time would have played that like people watch test matches here like over five days. And it's a bit like playing chess with a computer. You wouldn't have to reply. You could go, I'm going to think about that one. I like this a lot, if I'm being honest. I like this a lot. So I'm in a sand trap, and I've got, like, whatever. That's the thing. But as I come over the lip, there's a roll down to the thing. And you've got this onion text. I'm going to give that a few hours to think about it. So it is like chess. It is like chess. I'll get back to you after the long weekend. There's much to consider. It's like a chess game. Anyway, I'm surprised that no one did it. But then, to be honest, the technology goes so fast that, frankly. Frankly, you could see the golf course and swing. The Wii probably came in within 10 years. Yeah, the Wii. It's reminiscent of original 80s computer games where it was just text-based things like that. You type it in and it's fun. I think it's inspired by my father was the biggest sports fan and sports. man or whatever person whatever you call it player that ever but really tight with money and would not get sky tv and then used to watch the cricket on teletext which is a the tv i don't know if you have that oh yeah yeah yeah no i know what you're talking about but yes explain it teletext some of the most british shit i've ever heard in my life yeah watch the cricket on teletext yeah but the

The ITV network had CFAX. I think this is a distinction, but the BBC version was called Teletext. And it was a very, very early version of what could be considered like a bit like the Internet or the Web anyway. But you could choose pages by using your post remote controls, because I don't think you could use it at all on an old television. But you'd have a remote control and you would key in the number and it would give you the weather report. block chunky graphics and things but when it would do the cricket it would just have England versus India and the score and obviously the score doesn't necessarily even go up with three maiden overs in a row so and the thing sure thing was not exactly automatic refresh so it's I mean it feels more like a fax machine than anything else yeah It's like a static fact. It feels like a step below watching sports in prison in terms of the accessibility and enjoyability. Yeah, that sounds like you have a gambling problem. Yeah. It'd be like being in the prison. But it was an earlier time. It'd be like the prison cell, and then the guy further down in another cell is tapping out the current. score of a very... You guys use a voice code to give you the score? It's that kind of vibe. These jails are so echoey, too. It's going to cause problems. You know, the concrete boxes. Yeah, also the cricket score is a particularly difficult thing to do in any way in semaphore. It's just complicated. So I liked... Why was I saying that? He used to do that. We used to make backwards things. Oh, yeah, because of Idea Day. there was another one i really loved i'm surprised nobody did it too which was uh i'm sure i've used this in a fiction thing but anyway they were called sweet teeth and they were a pack of candies in the shape of teeth white you know like um candies or mints or whatever like that and if you were a kid you could just shove like five of them in your mouth and then your friend would just whack you on the side and all your teeth would

Oh, wow. This is experiential. I thought it was just like a chiclet vibe, but I see where you're going. I thought you were going more like the gummy teeth that people will wear for like... Like Dracula for Halloween, yeah. No, no, no, just like these are regular candies. They just happen to be in the shape of like whole molars or incisors or whatever, that sort of thing. So you could chew them for fresh breath or you could play a prank with your buddy. Exactly. And they have a punning name because sweet teeth, you know, have a sweet tooth or whatever. And these are actual tooths, plural, teeth. Okay, well, I know what you're getting for Halloween. I mean, for Christmas. Well, that was what I wished. I was surprised. No, I wasn't. I suppose. Not really. About that one. But the one about the golf, certainly, hundreds of them. And then loads of them did get done and do exist. And just become things like Instagram, basically, or Twitter or whatever. Sure, sure. But when you read about them, Dan. And annoyingly, Flipside also became a TV show. Very, very, very popular. Someone else in the name of it, I always forget. But the one where people watch TV. whatever that's called like talk soup no no it talk soup's not live though that's the talk soup is that but it's not live did you know that i made the soup i made the uk version of the soup i did yeah i read i read the i read your wiki that's why you dropped it in because you're so smart on these things the um yeah i'd forgotten i also made a great program which was the reason i stopped making tv and started idea because i made uh the international sexy ladies show for the um uh what's the males the brother version of the e-network called i made it for them okay uh i can't remember what they're called i didn't know there i didn't know that existed yeah it's like um bravo but over there well you have bravo too but it's like the the british bravo spike tv spike tv oh yeah anyway that

Wow, I forgot about Spike TV. You could see some titties on Spike TV now. Well, you could in the International Sexy Ladies show as well. I was going to say, I had a feeling maybe you were pushing titty all over America. I like that. It was a comedy, but it was a clip show based from porno clips, but weird fetish porno clips, which now is just like, I've noticed. Just regular things weird. Yeah, that's the problem. Now they're everywhere, but then they were extraordinary. And so then we would change the, I guess the read or the context of what it was and as a comedian narrated over. Well, it was beginning to kill me. And so that I quit and the start of the second series of that and just walked out and said, no more sexy ladies. I'm out. I'm off to sell books. Technically the best job in the world. Nope. I couldn't do that. This is the best job in the world. The only thing about that, which I love is a really good. anecdote where i so basically when you make tv clip shows everything that's said in the whole tv program has to be not legal but at least documented or whatever like that and you kind of submit it so if it's going to brawl in the past yeah you understand um and some of these clip shows would have been from different countries so you'd have a bit of russian in there a bit of ukraine or whatever this kind of thing and there was one with these italian girls i'm not sure what they were doing but they were um doing it with um a big uh digger like uh anyway they had hard hats on and not much else and whatever they're forklift certified italian baddies yeah okay yeah whether they were italian or not but they anyway they and so they they spoke like a line or two and then but it was the only italian in the whole thing and then we would have to get it like in these days translated again because it was not something you could easily do it's before google translate yeah so and also like you know you'd have to actually be able to write it down anyway the point was it would have cost us like 300 pounds to get the translator to do that and i suddenly thought no what about bruno's downstairs because we used to make these tv programs in our same office that we have idea from now and bruno's is the you know famous yeah like uh greasy spoon downstairs and um

So I got it burnt on a disc and I put it into a, what do you call it? Discman, whatever. Yeah, whatever. Took it downstairs. Ran it downstairs with, you know, these headphones or whatever like that. And I just went straight in and there's the guy, you know. Bruno in the flesh. Victoria or whatever his name or whatever, that sort of thing. I was like, hey, Victoria, quick, just lean over here. This will take you two seconds. She only says two lines. I put the headphones in his ears. I hit play on it. I go, just tell me what she says, like that. Hit play. And he goes, I've got to tell you, I'm not Italian. He ruined his whole fucking thing. Wow. And even when I go back in the next week, he's like, hey, ciao. Whatever. Ciao. What are you doing? I put the things in like that. Tell me what she says. And he just looked at me with his painful eyes. I'm not Italian. You got it out. You got it out. Bruno on the spot. Wonderful. All right, David. I'm sorry. Go ahead. One last question. One last question. You mentioned a few celebrity folks who you can count as a customer of your business. I'm assuming these are people who come in or request rare, expensive books or sometimes super books. Yeah. And I'd like to know, maybe Chris can answer what the difference between a book and a super book is. Has there been a celebrity who comes in? Oh, I can answer. I can answer. So, yeah. The super books cost more. That's the number one answer. That's simply it. I'd like to think that there's a little more nuance to it. There's more. There's more. There's more. There's more. But is there a celebrity who's contacted you or come in and said, hey, David, my name's Brad Pitt. I'm looking for this one particular book. And you're like, oh, Brad, no one can get that. And he's like, money's not an object. Is there anyone out? Are you currently on the hunt? for any super books for a celeb, and can you tell us all the intimate details about that, please? The trouble with the celebrity thing is, like, we don't mind saying who it is, but what I've realized is that when we say who comes in the store, and they've been fabulous people, I should tell you about the Robert Patterson one before we go, because we could probably squeeze that in, and it does amuse me greatly. But the trouble is, is that...

People like me, you and Chris listen to this kind of thing and then and then go into idea and amazingly are standing there with people like you, me and Chris who listen to this kind of thing. They're like, fucking what is this? You know what I mean? That's the weird thing about saying that celebrities come in, although on the on these blessed days for some people come in, just not when you're going to come in. Listener. Usually not. But there have been. fantastic times and when people people tend to start for the duration if there's somebody mega in there you know when they were just popping in and then you know like oh brilliantly i had to shout out to my um daughter who uh who came in i think i must have texted her when um robert patterson came in and she appeared within half an hour Wouldn't you know, I was just around. I was around the corner. Dad, what's going on in here? She put her head around the door and said that she'd just come over to get a cup of sugar. I have to say, that's world class. done that in a long time since about 1950 in a long time during rationing in a long time it's pretty good that's how i mean i've met i've met your daughter a few times my wife is friends with her she loves her so that sounds like the type of hijinks that she'd get up to yeah she was capable of that but the other great one about robert patterson was when so he came with his girlfriend whose names i didn't write down so i can't remember um but she's Yeah, but I tended to keep thinking of her as Daisy because I think she played that character in the TV series. I've plugged her back by covering for that. Anyway, she was around for ages with Robert, like on a Sunday and there was not many people there and they were hiding out and he was vaping in the corner of our book room whenever I looked in. He was completely lovely. Two hours, me and Angela and them two. So like a foursome, you know, you get to know each other like fine.

yeah wonderful then another round of biscuits robert something like that exactly that a year later i just came downstairs because the store is below here and um i could just feel like someone looking at me in a funny way like as they came out and i was like somebody's here I just look in the book room and Robert Patterson just looks up and goes, oh, hi, mate. And I was like, oh, good. Yeah, hi. You know, because you're back. And then I hear Angela's voice and I just know from the way she was talking to him, she has no idea who he is. That's good. That's good. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and you can imagine that he was like, I've got to go back to that place where they don't know who the fuck I am, even though I told them in great detail about making the Batman. Anyway. So you never saw Twilight or anything? Wow, okay. It wasn't just the tone of Angela's voice that made me realize she didn't know who it was. She asked him where he lived. And she asked him what he did. And he goes, I can hear this from the other room. I was just dying. But anyway, what do you do? Oh, like I'm an actor. And she's like, oh, yeah, great. Where do you live? And he goes, Los Angeles. And she said, oh, well, that's got to be good for getting work. I mean, she's not wrong. That's just an innocent conversation. Well, hopefully it works out for you. Keep shooting for the stars. What you said in him was Bobby. That's cool. Look, it's a hard business, but I believe in you. I believe in you. It's going to be tough. The road is long. But, you know, when you treat a celebrity like a real human being, especially because you have no idea who they are, that's the type of establishment where people want to... head into talking to some biscuits and feel like a real human being. That's how you do that advert voice. Yeah, yeah, you can tell, David. It's good, I like it. You've got my card, don't you? Yep. You've got my card. Thank you, David. We appreciate it. Oh, it's been a real pleasure. No, I know. I'm glad we finally made it happen. And you guys are familiar with idea books. Follow on Instagram. Buy a hat. Buy a super book. Do whatever you can. Yeah. If you can't afford a super book, you can buy the hat based on it. I can't afford a book hat next time. When Griffith Park blows up, we know who to come kind of look for. So thank you for giving that away. All right. We'll see you soon. Bye.

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